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MetalMX
12-21-2009, 07:00 PM
This is an article about The Active thyroid Hormone T3 and its role in the regeneration of peripheral nerves.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17402861

This could definitely be a treatment option for some people.

I developed peripheral neuropathy from long standing untreated hashimoto's thyroiditis and have been using primarily T3 with good success. I have finally begun to feel relief from these peripheral neuropathy symptoms. Return in muscle strength and size, less eye floaters, almost complete reduction in tingling in arms and legs as well as numbness and tingling in fingers.

If you have PN of any cause you could look into T3.




Rrae
12-21-2009, 09:36 PM
Hi MetalMX
And thank you for that info! I've been wondering if there was any connection between my PN and my HyPOthyroid. My diagnosis didn't specify Hashimoto's, but I'm up to Sinthroid 125mcg and STILL showing low T levels.
My symptoms don't quite match yours, I suffer from severe bilateral leg pain (piercing at the knees radiating outward as a burning pain)
Does your PN produce that kind of pain??
I don't know anything at all about T3 or where to get it or if it's safe to take with my other 'cocktail' of supplements. The article you provided kinda goes over my head, so hopefully some of the other PN regulars will see your thread and feed into it.....

This looks promising and i hope you're on to something!
Glad you shared! :Tip-Hat:

filipe
12-22-2009, 05:36 AM
The only problem is that this study is from 2007. Is there any new develops going on? There is a lot of hope but there is nothing for sure. It seems like they have to sell every lyrica and neurontin they have until new medicine and new approaches be reality...

PS: sorry about my english but I think you got the point

mrsD
12-22-2009, 07:11 AM
This study directly applied T3 to the nerves-- large sciatic nerves that were damaged. It was not delivered orally.

Oral administration will dilute your dose considerably.

It is well known that hypothyroidism causes peripheral nerve problems. This was my initial cause, in fact.

When I was given Synthroid (T4) finally, my nerves improved considerably.

The body normally converts T4 to T3 in tissues as it is needed.
If one takes too much T3 it will promote bone tear down and create osteoporosis. It can also stress the heart. This is why the body is careful in making small amounts as needed.

Rrae
12-22-2009, 12:20 PM
Do you ever become 'worn out' from all the questions we bombard you with?!:p

I don't know WHY i didn't see and latch on to the fact that HypoT was your initial culprit with PN....but i was up late last nite looking thru older threads and this subject was broached and one of the posts jumped right out at me.
I will try to cut/copy......

"the old TSH range was around .5 to 5.5, but the newer Academy of Endocrinology guidelines suggest .3 to 3.0 is a better range, given subclinical/borderline cases of hyporthyroidism. And, as Mrs. D has pointed out, hypothyroid conditions tend to result in fiborous tissue being deposited at the joint areas, often narrowing already narrow canals that nerves pass through, and thus causing nerve compression and neuropathy--and the knee joint, which the sciatic peroneal branch loops around very close to the hard tissues of the knee, certainly qualifies as such a place."
Posted by Glenn

My MAIN issue is the piercing/burning pain at both KNEES that radiates outward to include both legs with the signature 'Burning' that PN is known for. Do you think PERHAPS this 'fiborous tissue' could be what is causing my problem? And if so, would it be wise to get an MRI WITH contrast (would the contrast catch this 'fiborous tissue'?) I did have MRI few years back but not with contrast.
The reason i sound so desperate is because in 2 wks i will be getting the SCS trial implant and once i get the permanent implant i won't be able to get MRI's. So if in fact there IS hope of getting relief from some other source than the invasive implant, NOW is the time for me to be enlightened.

Hypothyroid seems to be my main culprit and 125mcg Sinthroid is pretty high dose to be on and yet i seem to STILL have thyroid issues......

I have had some people confused about WHY i am getting the implant. I've gone thru all the preliminary workup and done MUCH study on them and am told that i am a perfect candidate, as the SCS (Not to be confused with a pain pump) will target the lower extremities causing my so-called Radiculopathy/Peripheral Neuropathy.

Since you've shared that your PN improved quite a bit when your thyroid issues were targeted, i'm just wondering if there's a chance i would be able to bypass this VERY expensive implant.....
What are your thoughts? No pressure intended :Help:

mrsD
12-22-2009, 01:29 PM
I wonder if Lidoderms would work for you?

I use them behind the knee when I have "knee pain". 1/2 patch is enough for this for me.

I think the most dramatic pain though is at the tarsal and carpal ligaments. That is where I had my issues.

T4 (levothyroxine) is converted by enzymes using zinc and selenium. So if you are low in those minerals, your conversion may be less than the norm.

Much of the understanding of thyroid hormones, is being challenged these days with reports about reverse T3...I don't think all the data on this is in yet. But it points to failure of T4 to be converted to the proper isomer of T3. Excess cortisol is implicated in this failure so far.

Rrae
12-22-2009, 02:11 PM
Thank you much !
So, perhaps if i take those 2 supplements, i would respond better to the Synthroid ? Does 125mcg Synthroid seem like an unusually high dose?
I'll be going to the health store soon and i'll be glad to pick some of that up.
Because as far as i know i'm not getting ANY zinc or selenium despite my high intake of the other supplements.

I did try the Lidoderm patches. They did help somewhat to 'mask' the pain a bit, but since the burning pain consumed the whole leg(s), i was only able to get a little 'numb' only at the knee.
Plus, my pain seems to be more in front of the knee, whereas you indicate yours is in behind the knee....

Believe me, if i could afford those patches, i'd have them stuck all OVER my body and i'd be a scary-looking 'Lidoderm Mummy' ha :Crazy 2:
Thanks once again for all you do....

mrsD
12-22-2009, 02:23 PM
Please tell me what you are taking now, before I give you any other suggestions.

Typically 100mcg of selenium is enough. Really high doses of this is no longer recommended. Also most multivits have both selenium and zinc in them. Do you take some combo product now?

Where you apply your patch is very important. If your whole leg hurts, I would put it on your back on that side just at the lumbar curve. This will interrupt pain signals and prevent them at the spinal level.

I saw a young woman at the clinic where I was working once, who was getting escalading dose up to 300mcg daily. Turns out she was taking her pill with her morning cereal. This is a definite NO..NO... and when I had her change it to empty stomach she was back down to normal dosing of 100mcg.

Rrae
12-22-2009, 06:20 PM
Thankfully i DO know to take the Synthroid on empty stomach....first thing in the morning (usually around 6am)... half hour later i take the B12 Methylcobalamin on empty stomach....

Then throughout the course of the day i take:
Vit E 1000 I.U. (whatever that means I U)
L-Lysine 500mg
Magnesium Oxide 800 mg
COQ-10 300mg
Vit D-3 1000 I.U.
Lecithin 1200mg
Glucosamine Chondroitin (probably too much since i found the chewies that taste like candy)
Fish Oil w/Omegas

I was looking at the Multi-Vit that i take and i don't think it's too good of a
quality one.... only has 55mg Selenium and 11mg Zinc, so i just now bought
the 50mg Zinc and the 200 mg Selenium separately

I may be forgetting something but that's the 'jist' of it
Let me know if i'm getting carried away with these.....! it's just that i'm so
desperate to fight this PN...everytime i hear of a new possibility, i go out and buy it.....
The only prescription meds (besides the pain meds) is the Sinthroid 125 and Wellbutrin 300mg/day oh, and prilosec OTC.

Lord have mercy

mrsD
12-22-2009, 06:25 PM
What kind of zinc did you buy? Zinc sulfate? That one is very hard on the stomach.

If you already bought the selenium, take it every other day.

That magnesium oxide is useless. Please read my thread on Vitamin forum and choose a more effective form.

Rrae
12-22-2009, 06:39 PM
Ok, got it :) every other day it is.

The Zinc doesn't say 'sulfate'.... in the fine print it just says Zinc Gluconate

I do have a different type of Magnesium, it's just plain Magnesium 250mg
So I'll take that instead of the Oxide

I'll check out the vitamin forum now (won't stay up all night again tho) !

Thanks for everything and have a Great Christmas!
Looks like we're gonna get an arctic blast here in the plains of the Central Midwest !

MetalMX
12-26-2009, 01:57 AM
The Hashimoto's causes peripheral neuropathy. It is reversible depending on how long you've had the disorder. For myself it might not be completely reversible.

I have symptoms of: muscle loss in arms and back, tingling sensations in the arms/tricep/forearms/upperback, and a burning sensation - due to the nerve irriation damage. And muscle weakness.

T4 and T3 should be used for replacement therapy together. In preparations such as Thyrolar. T4 only replacement will cause lingering symptoms of hypothyroidism to continue. Due to impaired T4/T3 conversion and Reverse T3 increasing in many people further slowing metabolism. This is why if you are on say 100mcg of T4 you should add 25mcg of T3 to it.

Peoples dosages depend on where their symptoms resolve some people do well on 100mcg T4, 25mcg T3. Some are on 200mcg T4 and 50mcg of T3. It depends on the person. Their are even people who only respond to T3 - Cytomel only which completely resolves their symptoms.

If you've had enough of thyroid problems check out this website for helpful information on how to be your own doctor:

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

In regards to peripheral neuropathy what i have found to work is ultra-high doses of MethylB12 anywhere from 20-30grams per day.

Another nutrient called Benfotiamine which is the fat soluble form of Vitamin B1 has also been extremely helpful for relieving PN symptoms in many people.

http://www.mcvitamins.com/neuropathy.htm

Your best bet is to find the underlying cause of your neuropathy and treat it vigorously as soon as possible so it doesn't get worse.

MetalMX
12-26-2009, 02:09 AM
For some people their could be a hidden genetic cause to their PN due to MTHFR mutation. Which is the gene mutation for folate metabolism. It simply means you cannot use regular folic acid due to this mutation and require the active form folinic acid.

Folinic Acid has many benefits for neurological disorders, elevated homocysteine levels, supports healthy methylation reactions in your body and supports your immune system and DNA repair and replication.

Hope this helps everyone.

mrsD
12-26-2009, 08:50 AM
In the US Thyrolar is not currently available (often is off the market for some mysterious reason) and Natural Thyroids are not available either (FDA acting upon them.)

Cytomel is still available (the only T3)

Some compounding pharmacies have natural animal derived thyroid powder, and are compounding capsules for some patients here and there.

NeuroLogic
01-07-2012, 06:32 AM
Any new research on this topic since 2009?