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Nicotine's magic !!!!!!!!

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Unread 01-07-2011, 06:57 AM   #11
krugen68
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Default Details of his initial study in 2002

http://www.sna.org.ar/pdf/publicacio...7n2_p95_97.pdf
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Unread 01-07-2011, 07:11 AM   #12
krugen68
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Default Fors, againsts, and those trying it

http://gp29.net/?p=519
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Unread 01-07-2011, 08:48 AM   #13
lurkingforacure
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Default exactly what I got too

[quote=krugen68;732146]
Quote:
Originally Posted by lurkingforacure View Post
We really wonder if the improvement is because these are all really stimulants and they are revving you up? I dont' get that taking a nico patch somehow makes your brain grow more nicotine receptors...which in turn makes your brain grow more dopamine receptors. This doesn't work for me. Maybe someone can explain it to me to where I can get it?

The other thing: I don't know that lack of receptors is the problem in PD. I thought it was the lack of dopamine producing neurons. Having all the receptors in the world will not help us if we lack the cell that makes what the receptor binds to, right? Or no?
QUOTE]

If I'm reading it correctly

http://www.macalester.edu/psychology...oholtobac.html
I got that too, and we know nicotine makes us feel better because it makes the neurons still functioning to produce/release more dopamine, but that is not the same thing as actually growing more neurons or receptors. I read Villiers post to say that more were actually grown.

And of course a DAT or PET scan would see more dopamine in the brain after nicotine, because nicotine has that effect, making the neuron release more. But again, simply seeing more dopamine on the scan does not mean more neurons or receptors have been grown, just that there is more dopamine in the brain after a nicotine infusion.

Forcing an already stressed neuron to produce or release more dopamine may not be a good thing. This is why we stopped the patch, plus, the therapuetic benefit began to really dissipate and not last as long...and of course when it wore off those offs became increasingly harder.
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Unread 01-07-2011, 09:29 AM   #14
krugen68
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Default what strength patch did you get up to ?

[quote=lurkingforacure;732442]
Quote:
Originally Posted by krugen68 View Post

Forcing an already stressed neuron to produce or release more dopamine may not be a good thing. This is why we stopped the patch, plus, the therapuetic benefit began to really dissipate and not last as long...and of course when it wore off those offs became increasingly harder.

In the clinical trial currently running in France they go to 90 mg, though some of his other trials went higher

http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT00873392

Apparently he took a patent out (with a n other ) for transdermal nicotine (patches) as opposed to the stop- smoking patches.
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Unread 01-07-2011, 10:33 AM   #15
villiers
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Default whatever......

i am just sharing my experience.......

i repeat what they told me

this is way more solid than just one individual own experiment
this is a 9 year research & protocol,financed by the public french health minister

i have tried 2 times to post a link to a thread of a parkinson french forum about this nicotine protocol ,with 40 comments from patients following Villafane's protocol
they rave about it ! it even worked for a 81 years old patient,

the moderator,because of posting rules,isn't alllowed to let me post that link

during my 2hr consultation,Dr Villafane received a phone call from a patient:she was travelling to India for the holidays and was asking stuff about her meds
I thought to myself "my god,this woman can stay seated in a plane for at least 8 straight hours ! this is something i cannot do anymore since 2 years "
he told me she was on nico since 5 years

of course,i wish there was a cure,something which will balance my body in a definitive manner

but guess what ?
i am already in such misery because of pd that i will do this protocol because it is working for hundreds of other people even if i don't understand everything they told me
and i personnally suspect,those scientists don't know 100% also why it works
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Unread 01-07-2011, 10:37 AM   #16
lurkingforacure
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Default Not normally the pooper

[quote=krugen68;732453]
Quote:
Originally Posted by lurkingforacure View Post


In the clinical trial currently running in France they go to 90 mg, though some of his other trials went higher

http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT00873392

Apparently he took a patent out (with a n other ) for transdermal nicotine (patches) as opposed to the stop- smoking patches.
OK, I'm normally not a party pooper but 90mg is one heckuva dose. We only got up to 14mg and when we tried the 21mg patch it made us sicker than a dog, could not tolerate the nausea.

There are cardiovascular issues with nicotine and seriously, those high doses could give someone a heart attack or worse. I know they monitored carefully and all, but a dose that high, for life, is untenable IMHO.

I don't think this therapy is what people think it is. I would love nothing more than for a patch to "fix" PD, but I dont' think this can do it. If it did, no smoker would ever get PD, yet they do. And if it did, we would not have progressed during the more than four years we took the patch, but we did.

I believe that the nicotine patch kicks the already stressed neurons into overdrive, forcing them to release dopamine. Nothing more. This is why you have to keep ramping up the dose: if nicotine were really growing new neurons, you would be able to reduce the amount of nicotine required to get therapeutic relief. But the fact that the researchers kept increasing the dose, to me, says that the participant(s) were continuing to decline and a higher dose nicotine was required to get relief.
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Unread 01-07-2011, 10:44 AM   #17
krugen68
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Default you're probably right but .........

[quote=lurkingforacure;732492]
Quote:
Originally Posted by krugen68 View Post

OK, I'm normally not a party pooper but 90mg is one heckuva dose. We only got up to 14mg and when we tried the 21mg patch it made us sicker than a dog, could not tolerate the nausea.

There are cardiovascular issues with nicotine and seriously, those high doses could give someone a heart attack or worse. I know they monitored carefully and all, but a dose that high, for life, is untenable IMHO.

I don't think this therapy is what people think it is. I would love nothing more than for a patch to "fix" PD, but I dont' think this can do it. If it did, no smoker would ever get PD, yet they do. And if it did, we would not have progressed during the more than four years we took the patch, but we did.

I believe that the nicotine patch kicks the already stressed neurons into overdrive, forcing them to release dopamine. Nothing more. This is why you have to keep ramping up the dose: if nicotine were really growing new neurons, you would be able to reduce the amount of nicotine required to get therapeutic relief. But the fact that the researchers kept increasing the dose, to me, says that the participant(s) were continuing to decline and a higher dose nicotine was required to get relief.
My neuro told me out of his 500+ PD patients I was the only smoker

I figure my current pack plus a day is 20-25 mg of nicotine, so I'm debating what patch to add - smoking more is impractical !
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Unread 01-07-2011, 11:23 AM   #18
krugen68
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Default Got confused on this but I think it makes cells

In a 2007 collaboration with researchers at the University of Pennsylvania and the University of Colorado at Boulder, Lester postdocs Raad Nashmi and Cheng Xiao and staff biologists Purnima Deshpande and Sheri McKinney created mice with fluorescent a4b2 receptors, and watched the results as the rodents received nicotine doses equivalent to a person smoking two to three packs per day. Over the course of a week or two, the mice sprouted significantly more a4b2 receptors in the midbrain, which processes rewards and is the seat of addiction. (Interestingly, Parkinson’s disease causes some dopamine-producing nerve cells within the midbrain to slowly die off.) When these cells were sprayed with nicotine, they fired about twice as often as cells from “nonsmoking” mice. “We’re essentially taking movies of events inside the neurons during the first minutes, hours, and days of nicotine addiction,” Lester says.
It appears that nicotine acts like a chaperone, a matchmaker, and a traffic cop inside the cell—a combination of roles that maximizes the odds that each nAChR the cell produces will actually reach the cell’s surface. As a chaperone, nicotine binds to nascent receptors’ subunits as they are being synthesized, preventing them from being chewed up by the cell. The details are still being worked out, but “the simple idea is that nicotine stabilizes the receptor in a conformation that does not appeal to the cell's mechanisms for eliminating poorly folded proteins,” says Lester. And, because the receptor’s binding box is made from amino acids on two of the five subunits, nicotine the matchmaker expedites their assembly by binding to the two free-floating halves of the box and holding them in the correct orientation. This gives the remaining three subunits something firm to latch onto, helping them fall into place. And finally, as the cell transports the newly assembled nAChRs to the neuron’s surface, the nicotine molecules bound to the receptors could act like a police escort, once again protecting them from the cell’s protein-digesting machinery.

http://eands.caltech.edu/articles/LX...r_Nicotine.pdf
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Unread 02-11-2012, 11:03 PM   #19
villiers
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Default

Dear brothers and sisters in misery

I wanted to update you about my results with the Nicotine protocol ,that i am following since 14 months now.

I am currently on 21 mg Nicotine patch + 1mg 1azilect per day +1 Sinemet LP 100/25 that i take 4 times per day

My life has improved in a very consistent way,shaking has almost disappeared (i still shake sometimes but quite rarely),my fatigue has gone away,i used to sweat continuously,sweating has totally disappeared.foot dragging days are over .

Stiffness is still present,but i would say i'm 50% less stiff .

I started Sinemet 2 months before starting the Nicotine,and i don't think my wonderful improvements are only the results of levadopa...it seems the nicotine improved the "on time" in a spectacular way !!
on off time,it depends...i would say better in general...sometimes excellent ,sometimes not good,very variable

I still have bad days ,this is not a miracle unfortunately but i have a lot and a lot of good days .

Very often,friends i had not seen for 1 year or many months, tell me that i seem to be way better than before .

the bad side effects ? i would say that i sleep with more difficulties,sleep hours are shorter and that i am more paranoiac and susceptible .

when i reached the 14 mg level,it took me 2 months to be able to get used to it,a lot of sleep problems,so i had to stay 6 months on the 14 mg level .

But the overall quality of my life has so muuuch improved ,it's worth it for me .

2 months ago,i met up with my Neuro,who i had not visited since 9 months...it was a very good day (meaning that day,my on time was working very nicely ),it took him 10 mn to understand,to recognize who i was,he was a bit shocked and his words were "if this was the 1st time,i saw you in my office,i am not sure i could detect you as a PD person!!"

this was wonderful to hear,but i am not gonna lie,there is days where my PD is quite flagrant still.

this year,i have been able to go back to brazil(12 hours of flight ! ),to go back to clubbing with friends,to make love ,to have long walks ...

i am very grateful to Prof Villafane...i told him that i did not understand why his protocol was not more wide spread...he told me straight in the eyes ,that this Nicotine protocol was not very expensive,easy to teach,easy to receive,all things Big Pharma labos are not very interested in !

Voila dear comrades,the results i wanted to share with you.

kind regards
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Unread 02-13-2012, 08:31 AM   #20
aftermathman
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Default A response from Parkinsons UK on this ...

fascinating subject.

"Hello all

This is a really intriguing area of research.

These early studies using nicotine patches are showing some encouraging results. But we need much larger and longer studies before we know for sure whether nicotine patches are safe and effective for people with Parkinson's to use as a long term treatment.

Until then, people should not start using nicotine patches without the explicit recommendation of their doctor.

Studies have shown that smoking slightly lowers risk of Parkinson's - but it doesn't prevent it absolutely. This suggests that the effects of nicotine may be quite subtle.

The research we're funding at the University of Oxford (which Ezinda highlighted) is investigating the potential of nicotine to treat Parkinson's. The hope is that we can develop treatments that can harness and boost the beneficial effects of nicotine. Such treatments would help reduce distressing side effects such as impulsive and compulsive behaviours, and may even slow the development of the condition.

Hope this helps to answer your questions.

Best wishes

Claire
Senior Research Communications Officer"

Take care,
Neil.
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